Yes, a full-time indie game team made this in the BGE.

If you haven’t noticed already, you can find the full write-up here

It wasn’t without challenges the engine itself threw at them though (mainly the performance of the graphics engine), but they managed to pull through and release a finished product.

Now I don’t doubt that the BGE has been (and still is) capable of complex games, but I can only say this. If a complex game project like this (that has not only been finished but also launching on Steam) cannot convince the BF that the BGE is worth saving and investing serious development into, then nothing will.

In the meantime though, those who stick with the BGE have a solid production they can aspire to, and hopefully it won’t be a project that breaks on the team due to new BGE bugs in future Blender releases. Personally I would like to hear the BF’s response on whether or not their plans regarding the BGE has changed in light of such projects, otherwise, the current BGE being done will be a done deal.

For those who need a shot in the arm though to continue with the BGE, enjoy.

This game, along with games like Yo Franke and Dead Cyborg, prove that the BGE can be used to make decent games.

However, that doesn’t change the overall quality of the BGE source, so we still have all the same problems, most of which are very likely to remain in the engine for quite some time, even if there’s a sudden resurgence of developer effort.

Really, if you know anything about the difficulties involved in creating software (and the level of specialization required), you know that there’s not much the BF can do to move the BGE forward; Game engines are not their core competency, and they simply don’t have the kind of developers that can make significant contributions in that area. Although, even if that expertise was there, I think they would probably decide to drop the existing rubble, and build something new, or work to integrate an open source engine.

I think there are people in the BF who understand this well, and who are therefore considering the removal of the BGE, in favor of something like “Interaction Mode”.

If you think about that, objectively, it makes perfect sense.

Step 1 = return bge to “Solid” code base (yes remove the hell out of features)

Step 2 = get physics, lighting/openGL , and dynamic loading working very well

Step 3 = get BGE -> BPY -> BGE model generation in game and a api to use it

Step 4 = make games , inside games, I don’t care what logic they use as long as it works.

I think this is how interactive mode should look,

as to I will escape… Solid looking game, with some decent looking game mechanics.

I’m well aware that the BF’s plans to replace the BGE with an interaction engine (which in turn will be somewhat less ‘game centric’) is likely to move forward amid their current support of people who have tried to work with the code, hence why a number of people here are looking at the alternative FOSS options that are emerging such as Godot and your engine (BDX).

Part of it really is to awake people who still think that if they can show the BF an awesome game made in the Blender Game Engine, then they will want to devote resources to making it a true, powerhouse game creation suite. I digress though, one of the reasons why I stuck with the BGE so long is because there was no other generalized game creator out there in FOSS that had everything from level building to script editing in a single package, but that is changing and people now have extremely viable alternatives to the BGE in the FOSS world.

Like Goran said, this is all cool but it’s not enough to fix the core problem. It demonstrates the BGE is useable, but nonetheless it has reached its full potential. For example, BGE can’t (or won’t) push into the mobile area for various reasons.

Of course, the BF has limited resources so the BGE doesn’t seem like a good investment (to pursue it’s current purpose as a standalone game engine), thus Ton’s tentative idea to recycle it into a tool more useful for Blender artists.

To get the BGE up to speed would probably require another BGE-focused open-source project like Apricot, but I have a feeling, Cycles is their top priority, next to Blender. So I’d say Cycles has pretty much bumped the BGE off the list.

Well great, this months iteration of this discussion. Can’t we let sleeping dogs lie?

It’s great to see someone who’s put a lot of effort into a game, and now it’s gone somewhere. Good luck with sales/promotion, and great work for managing to complete a game to a level that steam will distribute it.

As mentioned I think the forums have had multiple threads of this same subject rumble through.
How I see it (I might be wrong) is blender is like a complex piece of game code constantly filled with issues. In many cases it is much easier and more efficient to just dump the broken code and start afresh (and do it properly), instead of constantly tweaking pieces here and there to try and solve one problem but just introducing more bugs. Even if there are quality games being released, its not going to fix the broken code, and the sheer effort let alone cost of getting rid of every single bug (and ensuring there will be no more) is not worth it. I personally don’t like the idea of an “interaction engine” as it makes BGE sound dull, and like some budget, free, simulator and would be much happier if they managed to implement another (not as broken) engine such as panda3D or (if possible) godot.

Interesting that we suddenly have all of these good quality finished projects coming out of the BGE now, Blendernation mentions that you can add one more to the list.

I’ve already been in the process of moving over to Godot, but if the BGE was to somehow get a massive second wind behind it that leads to massive bugfixing, code cleanup/organization work, and across-the-board enhancements (like in graphics), I guarantee that a number of former users will take a second look at the BGE and maybe even use it again for projects.

Though again, if the BF isn’t convinced by all of these projects to make that second wind a reality, then yes, the BGE is about done (though with the prospect of BDX, project Harmony, and plugins tying in other FOSS engines real tightly, the days of Blender being where you make your games may not come to an end as a result).

The number, and quality of games made with the BGE doesn’t change the state of the BGE.

I’m pretty sure that people in BF understand the potential value of a game engine, and that they certainly want to modernize the BGE (they’re not stupid), but they don’t have the required expertise, and even if they did, there’s no solid foundation to build on.

Realistically, there’s nothing the BF can do to significantly move the BGE forward.

Their best bet, both long and short-term, is to simply continue improving Blender as an editor, and as a scripting environment, which will enable other projects to write better plugins, in a more straightforward way.

Also, developing “Interaction Mode” is essentially the best foundation you can have for a new internal engine, if one is to be developed at some point in the future.

So, that’s not the death of blender as a game development environment -> It’s actually an ideal beginning.

So to say that the excuse not to invest (even moderately) time and maybe some money on BGE improvements is that there is NO big games (exploiting the current potential of BGE) launched using said engine?
Comparisons with ‘engine x or y’ is not helpful. Perhaps we should remember that the FB is a non-profit entity (at least in my understanding), then your focus should be on meeting the demands of its users.
No one is asking to leave the part of rendering stop but ostracism to which the BGE is played for many years is amazing, to say the least.
And, honestly, turn it into interactive mode (whatever that means at the moment because we do not have enough information, except Ton) will be the final nail in the coffin of BGE. Especially if there is no support or at least a possibility to export executable as the current model. Although in later versions 2.5x this feature (export as exe) was provided in the form of add-on for some kind soul of the community. Unless I’m fooling myself.
Anyway, in my opinion should not be too difficult to review the code. Facilitating, only leave the GLSL mode 3D rendering engine, withdraw features that are affecting the overall performance of the engine but do not kill the poor as if killing a chicken in his backyard.
And I agree with AceDragon: the launch of I Will Escape (and Krum and others to come) not convince FB administratitava summit to invest and cares about the game engine is feasible, nothing convecerá.
Finally, I agree with an article I read on a website: FB have to focus on becomes the only 3D Blender in a feature that makes killer. And the Blender Game Engine may well be it. What other suite has a game engine working in harmony with His area of surrender?
This is my opinion about all this discussion is the FB or not kill the BGE as we know.

At this point, I would say to everyone who wants to start a big project in the BGE, don’t.

Your dream will only end you up in disappointment when the BGE is discontinued and your project can’t be worked on anymore if you want to keep with the latest Blender version. Use Godot or BDX instead if you want to make a game with Blender as a major tool.

Once the Blender Interactive engine is dropped in to replace the BGE, it should be made clear on IndieDB and other sites that it’s a discontinued engine. Also, the BGE forum section should be recycled into a section covering development in all engines (making use of Blender as a tool of course) and a new support forum for the interaction engine. The worst thing one can do is encourage people to use the BGE for big projects when its days are nearing an end.

This seems very contradictory of the thread title, let alone the majority of the thread.

I completely disagree that people should stop using BGE, we are only in 2.72 and the BGE is only being replaced by 2.8, at least a year if not more.
So why walk away sulking when you could make the most of what is there (while it still is)?!
Besides most of the major games that have been developed were done in earlier versions of blender (like 2.5 and 2.6), so if you want to make a game big or small just use one of these versions, since 2.71+ is very unstable and buggy.

You can’t simply recycle an amazing community to fit another software, it doesn’t work like that. People will walk off and disappear (probably to unity), while the more experienced will perhaps move to godot (as without the current BGE community, I doubt BDX will take off).

If you want to go and sulk in a corner, be my guest, but otherwise stop discouraging people from doing what they love :ba:

Oh, c’mon guys! BGE is just a tool, you can make games with whatever engine you like.Stop complaining about features and what not. Just for 1-2-3 people BGE is the right one…faster, way,way more faster workflow than Unity or any other engine out there(stating this as 4+yrs Unity user in my day job)

If BF remove or convert BGE to something else, it will not be because there are problems with integration or there are no programmers that can do it…this is bul**t, I have a colleague programmer, that can do whatever he wants with bge even mobile integration in a matter of days.
BF will just change the name of bge, because it is not competitive with other engines and soon it will be silly to call it game engine and that is because the focus of the foundation is 3d modelling not games, which is fine for me.
Just do your games with bge, try do it with other engines…compare the result.

I have done this, and If you are >5 guys with solid salaries on 8h+ day job, then bge is the wrong choice, but if you are less than 4-5 and not getting any money for this, then believe me bge is what you need…hell…the free version of Unity don’t even come with shadows, nor image effects(glsl for Unity), nor nothing.
Of course 1500$ change things…ohh and don’t forget updates - 2-3 per year, which is 500$ per update. That is the situation for almost any other engine out there.Don’t drool on youtube videos of what other engines can do- they can not! People and money do this things. The only true free engine by this time is BGE.

PS. Lets do the math(Funny, funny math)

  • Lets say we are 4 guys using Unity for indie games that is 1500$*4=6000$
  • Lets say we will do the game for one year( that is 3 Unity updates) - 3*500$*4guys=6000$
  • Lets say we will use Unity Asset Server(It is meant to be used by team members working together on a project on different computers either in-person or remotely.), which is 500$ per license=2000$(and yes Unity Asset Server is a must for a team project)
  • Lets say we will make multiplayer game, so we will need Photon Server, which is around 300$ for 100 users online, now lets say we think we will have 1000 users online max=3000$
  • Lets say we will make web version of the game, so we need unity web server, which is around 100$ per month.

And the math is: 6000$+6000$+2000$+3000$+100(just for the release) = 17100$ for 4 guys
Nice ahh :smiley: (In my company 15 people are using Unity, and its about 60000$ in expenses just for the engine.)

Now compare with BGE…its your choice. :stuck_out_tongue:

The truth is that the engine is fun to work with, unity and godot just are not,

There is nothing holding me back in my own game except the random crash on ending a constraint and I have not checked to make sure that is not from double execution etc,

Also my project has gotten complicated but is still kicking,

The only reason I suggest a refactor is no one wants to kick around a glob of source code they can’t wrap there head around.

If your friend can track down a few of the physics, libload, and constraint related crashes, it would make me happy.

When the BGE is removed, there will be no need for the official forums to have an entire section just for the BGE. Also to BPR, a good and solid engine should not have to make you code workarounds to the point where it risks making your own game code unreadable (workarounds that you sometimes have to add because of new engine bugs). Engines like Godot just have a brighter future because their source code is much cleaner and much more inviting to developers and things right now for the most part just work. You shouldn’t have to do some equivalent of a personal hail Mary in the hopes that your hard work is still playable when a new version of Blender comes out.

And Haidme; If you think you can find someone who can clean up and fix the BGE code to the point where things just work and eliminate the need for workarounds (along with it being attractive to developers rather than pushing them away), you would then have the right to be considered the savior of the BGE. I’m done with waiting in hoping my projects can go on without fearing that they will break (joint functionality for instance has gotten worse in the last one or two release), the FOSS world is actually getting some nice looking alternatives now that share the fully-integrated environment structure common in commercial engines.

Also, I’m not saying that people should stop doing what they love, but if that love is making games, then there are better solutions for that emerging that also don’t require you to pay a cent (and I’m not talking limited free versions).

The BGE, as it stands, is a very powerful tool, which can be used to make fairly ambitious games (the ones referenced in this thread prove that to be true). No matter what the BF decides to do with the engine, people will still be able to use it, and if the BGE is sufficient for the actual needs of their project, I think they should (or, at least, I think it’s one of the better options in the open source world).

However, people who remain in the BGE community, with an expectation that the BGE will improve, drastically, over the next few years … It’s very likely that those people are wasting their time here, and should move on to other things.

I think the perspective of the BF is very clear, and guided by a rational assessment of where the BGE stands (as a software project), and what the BF can realistically do with it (very little).

Are his patches in the tracker?

The fate of BDX is uncertain, but I don’t see how it would be tied to the fate of the BGE community.

I think success will depend largely on how well the engine serves the requirements of most independent game developers, the simplicity of the API, and the quality of the documentation (including examples, video tutorials, etc).

Anyway I don’t think that the BGE will be removed from blender in a short/medium time. As example, a statement from Ton in the last code.blender.org news (http://code.blender.org/index.php/2014/12/future-viewport-the-design/)

My preference is that the GE will then use the same viewport code for drawing and shading.

Basically, I think a new GLSL realtime renderer for blender will be developed and the BGE will use that renderer

On the topic at hand: This game looks awesome. I’ll definitely be buying when it’s available on Steam/Linux.

On that other issue: Having the Blender API accessible for realtime applications is a good thing.

No matter what the BF decides to do with the engine, people will still be able to use it

However, people who remain in the BGE community, with an expectation that the BGE will improve, drastically, over the next few years … It’s very likely that those people are wasting their time here, and should move on to other things.

Very sensible statements if I might say.

Since we’re already talking about GODOT and GDX, I’ll go ahead and throw Urho3D out there for completeness.
It’s wicked fast, cross platform, and under active development. A very good option if you don’t mind dipping your hands in code.

Woah, deja vu

Hi I hope you are having a good day.

So the with Death of the BGE fast approaching will the mean the death of the forums as well?

@pqftgs

It’s BDX, not GDX. :smiley:

The BGE can never really die. It’s open source software, which will remain relevant for as long as it has users.

The BF may decide to take it out of Blender, at some point in the future, but even if they do, you can simply use a version of Blender that last shipped with the BGE, and continue to use it.

I think there will be a good number of people who will do that (if for nothing else but to finish existing projects), and so, for them, the forum would still be useful, and that can probably be used to justify its continuing existence.