Is Firefox becoming yet another self-destructing FOSS app.?

I tell you the truth, I’ve tried to stick with Firefox as long as it worked for me, and at one point was one of the biggest success stories the FOSS world has seen.

But now it seems, the Fox is now following the GIMP into an era where it becomes irrelevant as the development increasingly becomes shot through with software ideology and disregard for the user experience.

A few days ago it auto-updated to the newest version, and it has led to the decision that I would switch to using Google Chrome, not because I want them to fail, but because their recent changes has bugged the browser to the point where sites containing heavy flash content would crash the GPU driver and make my PC feel like it’s on the fritz.

This isn’t even the worst part, the worst part is, based on what I read, is that no one in the Firefox dev. team even cares at the moment, emphasizing the very negative aspects that FOSS is often stereotyped with (and you’d think that supporters of free and open software would want to make an effort to combat that). That browser is now unusable, and Mozilla doesn’t even place the fix for that on utmost priority.

Oh Firefox, thank you for giving more people the impression that FOSS is the worst idea ever to come about in software development, your marketshare is plummeting as we speak and you have shown that you are not able to hold onto your past success in the wake of new alternatives and the vastly improved versions of Internet Explorer.

To be honest as a conclusion, if they wind up in the FOSS graveyard in five years, it will only be by their own doing. At least it uninstalled and came off my hard-drive neatly.


No offence intended, but you do over-dramatise; and why do you need to make a public announcement anyway, it’s only a change of web browser? Relax…

:stuck_out_tongue:

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Yes the old is better, The last update I got 2 months ago i do not like.

One of the points here, is just how far Firefox has fallen.

A few years ago, Firefox was getting closer and closer to matching IE in marketshare, they had it, the ball was in their court and all they had to do was keep doing what made Firefox such a good browsing solution.

But this is FOSS we’re talking about, and in a good chunk of cases, it means, “the user be danged, we don’t care about their opinions and suggestions, we will develop the software according to where we feel it should go and they will use the software as we give them”.

-People didn’t want to move towards copying Chrome, that’s what they did
-People didn’t want addons breaking all the time, that’s what they did
-People liked their customization options, the dev. team had a different opinion
-People were reporting driver problems with video and such, the dev. team shrugs it off and continues working on new stuff
-People wanted some of the bloat cut out, but if the dev. team doesn’t agree, then screw your opinion.

The above is very similar to the crap that GIMP users have had to go through, the worst of FOSS in a nutshell and what stands out to outsiders, now Blender is also not an app. with a stellar record of addressing usability concerns and requests at times, but it still looks pretty good compared to others.

The fact is, Mozilla is currently on a path that will lead to them closing their doors, and they don’t seem to have any interest in initiating a new direction that removes disconnect between the developers and the users.

I used GIMP to create the meme…lol…just had to.

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I am quite entrenched in the Chrome camp, but since all web browsers are free, the only way to get Chrome users over to Firefox was to be more Chrome-like. This and GIMP aren’t comparable to specialty software like Blender or CAE programs like openFOAM because the user base is more willing to compromise/adapt.

I stick with Firefox because I like my bookmarks in a sidebar. There’s a Chrome addon for that, but the colors suck, so I’m staying where I am.

So, here’s another headline: Blender User Sticks to Firefox!

:smiley:

I don’t think I’ve updated in a couple years myself.

As I said, I wanted to stay with Firefox, but it got to the point where the amount of issues introduced started surpassing the amount that were fixed. People for example were reporting blue screen errors on Windows 8 over the past several versions, but to their dismay it has not become a high priority for Mozilla as they continue to add new stuff (and so remains unfixed, this being something they can definitely learn from the Blender project). Consider yourself lucky if you haven’t yet seen any deterioration in the stability and robustness of your copy.

Kbot, you got that meme backwards, I switched to Chrome.


but since all web browsers are free, the only way to get Chrome users over to Firefox was to be more Chrome-like

This would be a double-edged sword for Mozilla, because if you decide to slowly remove what makes Firefox ‘Firefox’ in favor of copying the Chrome experience, then why should people settle for a watered-down experience that might even feel unfinished when they can just use Chrome? This is a bit different from say, Blender copying Maya because Chrome is also a free application.

If Mozilla just stuck with enhancing the Firefox experience that everyone knew and loved (along witha a higher emphasis on fixing browser) they would not be having to deal with the increasing migration of users to other products as they are seeing now.

I only have Windows 8 on one computer (a notebook) and all I use it for is watching Netflix. When it flakes out, I have Chrome installed as well. When Chrome flakes out, I go back to Firefox.

As for my ‘real’ computer, there’s no way I’m installing Windows 8. W7 works, it ain’t broke; I’m not ‘fixing’ it. :wink:

Since it seems to be a problem only for Windows, you could just switch to linux and keep FireFox.

I’m on Windows 7, and the problem seems to be coming to that version too.

And the switch to Linux part, this is precisely one thing that leads people to hate FOSS, developers who don’t care about issues on Windows because of their beliefs of it being owned by the ‘evil empire’ so to speak.

You decide to let things break down on Windows and you might as well say goodbye to more than 95 percent of your userbase, as in, reducing your project to another obscure Linux app. that tries and fails to rebel and fight the power (also known as commercialism).

Thing with progress is that there is always a trade off…

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Google is, and has been for quite some time, the number one, by far, benefactor of Mozilla Firefox. Not only paying Firefox for each search referred to Google through Firefox, Google is the default search engine, but also having been chief among those corporations that paid engineers to work on the development of Firefox.

“If you want an Internet – which means, in many ways, a world – that isn’t controlled by Google, you must stop using Chrome now and encourage others to do the same, If you don’t, and Google wins, then in years to come you’ll wish you had a choice and have only yourself to blame for spurning it now.” -Robert O’Callahan Mozilla Engineer, a sentiment echoed by Mozilla’s Director of Product Management Chad Weiner.

Perhaps Google was just using Firefox all along in a two pronged attack against once internet powerhouse Microsoft. Really Firefox did the lion’s share of the work in putting a dent in IE’s dominance, a task perhaps impossible without Google’s funding and development support. Now Google swoops in with their own militia firing everything they’ve got at a badly damaged Microsoft now surrounded and fending off attacks from their enemies on all fronts.

Going head to head with Microsoft was an inevitability for Google, as an internet company Microsoft’s internet browser dominance put Google’s sovereignty at stake, in those days all Microsoft would have had to do was release a patch that “accidentally” broke compatibility with a few Google products to sanction Google and strong arm them into abandoning any competitive moves. Attacking Microsoft on the browser front was a must in order for Google to take on Microsoft in the OS and mobile OS markets.

At this point Firefox’s usefulness to Google is waning, they still provide an inroad to the open-source and anti-corporate community through search referrals, but ultimately Firefox will only become more of a roadblock than anything else. Goole used Firefox, nothing more, the time at which point Google is ready to toss Firefox to the wayside is fast approaching. The next step for Google on this chess board is providing access to the internet, which they’re already rolling out. Another necessary step to ensure sovereignty and secure their revenue streams, they can’t have all these third party internet service providers controlling access to Google products now can they?

Ok, so i have a Win7 64bit and the flash does crash from time to time. So that is from the firefox?

Nothing they (Mozilla) can do about that if they start to introduce issues like driver crashes on sites with video and other heavy content.

Mozilla’s software ideology leads to a buggy browser and Google Chrome attracts its users by purring like a kitty, now whose fault would that be? It’s like GIMP forfeiting the chance of preventing Adobe from taking control of the photo editing market because of, again, putting software ideology above users.

I get Occasional flash issues but it never crashes the gpu and if I wait a bit it will resolve itself.

I update flash every time they offer a new update and things get better for a time.

As I recall both Google and ForeFox are betting on html 5 to replace flash but that is not happening, at least not as fast as they thought.

Newer Google Android OS does not support flash at all. but most sights will offer up the same video using html5. I wonder if I removed flash on my computer which sites would quit working?

Not that I intend to do that in the near future. I’ve spent too much of my life fighting various software issues(20+ years in IT) for a corporate master that did not have my best interests in mind, only profit. Now I just want to use the tools to make music and art for myself. Hopefully someone else will enjoy it as well but I will do it even if its only for myself.

@Ace Dragon: I hear ya, ultimately it’s six of one and a half dozen of the other. Doesn’t really matter which organization you support, most, if not all, have generally self serving hidden motives.

@tomtuko: Very interesting, perhaps this is a strategy bent on diminishing the prevalence of Flash and moving administrators in favor of HTML5. If 24+% of your traffic can’t use your site because of a ‘bug’ in their favorite browser then you might think twice about making the switch to HTML5.

It’s all about leveraging your assets.

P.S. You have to admit it does seem a little strange for an issue like this not to be of high priority. As for me though, streaming video, such as YouTube, hasn’t worked on my mobile for quite sometime, plus it crashes and reboots all the time and really I couldn’t care less. With or without streaming video I’m happy just to have what I have.

There’s absolutely nothing wrong with wanting more, but as with all things you’ve got to ask yourself, at what cost?

That’s because of Flash. I’ve had it crash in FF, Chrome, and IE. It depends on how far behind the security envelope they are at the time. :slight_smile:

Basically, what I gather when it comes to complaints is this.

Corporations - Putting the bottom line above users
FOSS - Putting personal software ideology above users

Not everything on both sides is like that, but it’s a falsehood to think that the FOSS equivalent will always have superior ethics, as sometimes it’s even worse.

Right now, the category that seems to have the best average ethical value in terms of listening to users and caring about functionality is the boutique software house category (with apps. that are usually priced between 50 and 500 USD for their flagship versions). Software in this category includes Genetica, Mixcraft, Photoline, and a number of others.